Funk me! It's Bill Laswell and his band of volumious jazz men, Last Exit, with a live album of the same name.

What do you get when you cross free jazz improvisation with a couple of Marshall stacks? Last Exit; a quartet of characters comprising Ronald Shannon Jackson (extremely loud drum), Peter Brötzman (the European on mad sax), Sonny Sharrock (perverted blues guitar), and Bill Laswell (6 string bass & effects)... Bill Laswell, now there's a name to conjure with, he's produced or co-produced albums by people as diverse as Laurie Anderson, Mick Jagger, Motorhead, Miles Davis & Bootsy Collins, not forgetting that mega-hit, 'Rockit' by Herbie Hancock. But who are these other people he's currently making noise with?

The 'skins' man has roots as a free jazzer, playing with cool dudes like Charlie Mingus & Ornette Coleman more recently his own band, the Decoding Society (who Laswell produced in 1985)

The 'strings' man has played with various free jazz groups & with Laswell in Material (an influential New York art-funk band). The 'reeds' man has been known to do workshops with primary school kids & jam with Tangerine Dream of all people, apart from working with the inevitable... Bill Laswell.

After seeing Last Exit assault an audience composed of musos, pop stars (Iggy Pop was there anyway) & journalists with a volume that wouldn't be out of place at a Motorhead gig, I went to talk with Bill Laswell & Peter Brötzmann about things musical, past, present and... I called it 'Heavy Metal Jazz', what did they call it?

"I'd call it improvised electric music, although I have heard other people call it that, especially regarding Sonny's guitar playing" says Bill "but I don't like to categorise it."

Last Exit have just done a 14 date tour of Belgium, France, Italy, Germany & Sweden & 2 nights in London. How have the different P.A. companies coped with the onstage mayhem?

"We have had sound problems because a lot of sound engineers have been expecting a quite trad-jazz type band," Peter remembers. "Also Shannon is a really loud drummer and he likes to hear things loud."

"There is a possibility to play quietly but it doesn't happen very often," Bill interjects, "and so for the first gigs we were losing the toms, because Shannon plays a lot of rhythms on his toms and when that was sorted out, we lost his snare."

Sounds familiar to anybody who's been at the mercy of some cloth-eared P.A. engineer. So what do they use onstage to make all this noise?

"I use an old Fender 6 string bass that was made in the late 60 s or the early 70's, I can't remember exactly," puzzles Bill. "I use heavy gauge strings to give me plenty of bottom end & I like to use Ampeg SVT tops or Marshall, with a 4 x 12 & a 2 x 15 cab, a Morley wha-wha & a Rat fuzztone. Sonny seems to favour a Marshall 100 watt top with two 4 x 12 cabs & a couple of pedals." Peter: "I use a Selmer super action sax with a radio mike & a thing called a Terragato, which is a sort of clarinet, a Folk instrument used in Hungary and parts of Rumania".

Your intrepid reporter had noticed that the drums being hit were a Sonor double bass drum kit with Paiste cymbals.

One thing that did intrigue me was how the songs or pieces were kick started into action, I wondered (aloud) if there were any structures that they followed, or did they just make them up on the spot?

Bill: "Occasionally there's a routine me and Shannon follow, a rhythm or pattern we may have played before, but it's never the same, basically we just improvise and things happen".

So are there set spaces for people to solo over?

Peter: "No, providing everybody is listening to whats going on it's generally no problem, whoever feels like playing just does it."

Last Exit have just released a live album on Enemy records that was recorded in Paris earlier this year. Was much done to the tapes?

Bill: "Not really, it was cleaned up a little, edited and some reverb added. Sonny made up some fairly inspirational titles for the songs and we put it out."

Does this point towards a long term project?

"A long term project thats on and off, we can only play with Sonny for about two weeks before he starts to get a little strange," laughs Bill.

Given Laswells past involvement with big names and big budgets, how come his latest offering is being distributed by Rough Trade in the UK?

This question sparked off a pet hate with Bill Laswell, namely record companies.

"At the time, I'm not sure major labels would pick up on this record. I have no faith in them, no respect whatsoever for companies. Whoever you go with they're bound to fuck up."

Mention the current state of Pop music and he's off again. "Pop music is more and more withdrawn from any possible relationship with this kind of situation," meaning Last Exit. "Its like a giant factory now, repeating itself. Theres always a trend going on, especially in England where they recycle music to the point where its amazing."

One of his favourite quotes is that of John Cage, who said "records will be made from records."

"Yeah, its literally happening in pop now. Look at the snare sound on Bowie's 'Low' album, it was copied all the time and recently, those little horn blasts Trevor Horn has used. That was copied immediately."

Mind you, Laswell isn't averse to a bit of plagiarism.

"I've gone into studios and made records from other records, with sampling, playing them backwards, tape manipulation and scratching them."

Talking of scratching, how about Laswells biggest selling production to date, Herbie Hancocks 'Rockit'.

"The bassline was taken from a vocal line I remembered, by Pharoah Sanders. It seemed to fit the song so I used it."

Hmmmmm, was he credited? No, I thought not. Was he surprised when Rockit was big?

"Yeah, I was really surprised, because we were just mucking about in the studio. The whole track was really quick to do, the rhythm track took about 3 hours to make in a 16 track studio in Brooklyn (OAO studios) that had just a console and no control room. The keyboards took about 2 hours and the mixing about 1½ hours. So that was really well planned" he laughs ironically.

As his attitude seems to be one of improvisation and spontaneity, how does he account for the production work he has done with 'Pop' artists like Jagger, or Nona Hendryx?

"It's like experiences that don't always pay you back musically, it's to do with learning to work with people, establishing patience."

Nothing to do with paying the rent no doubt.

"Things that I have any control over now, records that I do myself, then Last Exit have a direct influence. For example, a cassette that me and Shannon did, I took it into the studio when I was working with Ginger Baker, and we made a track out of it. The whole track came about as a result of improvisation."

Laswell has just done an album with Motorhead in a new studio called 'Master Rock', he's worked with Bootsy Collins "which is an experience", Sly and Robbie "which is always an experience" and also did the production honours on the new PIL album. This sparks off another pet hate, touring for promotional purposes.

"Most music that's played live now is purely for promoting a product, it doesn't have any relationship with getting up and playing music. I mean, take Public image for example, the bassist is having to play a two note riff in one of their songs, which is a really dumb riff. I did that bassline in a studio as a joke! Now he has to play this two note riff for like 40 dates, the same two."

How then, can Laswell be playing a 14 date tour and just happen to have a live album out at the same time? Surely he isn't promoting it?

"Obviously we want people to hear us but this situation with Last Exit is really just another thing thats available to do musically. I mean, me and Sonny (guitar) and DST (the scratching DJ from Rockit fame) did some gigs in Europe just to play and to see what happened. That was a really good situation because you had Sonny playing free guitar, me on bass and DJ from the Bronx scratching records, creating rhythms. That's not music for promotion, we didn't have a record to promote."

Fair enough, how about New York, whats happening there?

Peter: "Nothing."

Bill: "More and more I see people latching on to stuff that originally started as underground things, like Hip Hop. Looking at that Janet Jackson record, that would never have come out if it wasn't for Hip Hop, you know, 'Nasty Boys'."

Did Laswell think Material had an affinity with any of the other so-called 'Art-Funk' New York bands like Defunkt or James Chance?

"No, the press were badly informed. Only James Blood Ulmer was doing a similar thing. I mean James Chance can't even play!"

Fair enough. Is nothing going down, man?

Bill: "There is some good stuff happening, especially with sound. I heard what Jason Cosaro (engineer at the famed New York studio, the Power Station) was doing to Tony Thompson's drum sound with the Power Station" (the group that is). "I hated the music, but thats a good drum sound. I've worked with him ever since."

It transpires that Laswell has a team of about 30 different musicians, engineers and technical people that he uses for different projects. A bit like Nile Rodgers I venture? He grimaces at the comparison and refuses to comment, it seems he doesn't want to slagg him.

One wonders what Bill Laswell and Peter Brötzmann will get up to next. Perhaps he will reproduce an album of Cajun funk, or a collaboration between Motorhead and Miles Davis. To give us a clue as to what might be coming next, I asked them who we should be listening to? Peter:

"Thats a hard question... Louis Armstrong, Miles Davis... people should find other musicians to play with, musicians should open their ears."

Bill: "Well I'm listening to Howlin Wolf and some Dub at the moment".

The mind boggles!