The long, winding, and sometimes crooked yellow brick road to success, or oblivion.

How much has the music business changed in the past 25 years? Certainly aspects of technology used for recording, and the ability to control signal parameters are vastly improved. In many respects it's not unlike comparing the Bleriot monoplane to Concorde. Perhaps though, it was more exciting to be a pioneer.

And then there's the 'big business' angle. It has changed the public's outlook on the music business completely. Small wonder that demo tapes have undergone something of a population explosion.

Since a band's first contact with a record company will normally be with someone from an A&R (Artist & Repertoire) department, it is essential to understand that their role is to find artists, and convince them that a certain record company is the one with whom they should sign that all-important recording contract. It's negotiation will generally involve both the A&R department and the more senior management of the company. The A&R people will then become closely involved with recording, and may well wish to influence which tracks the band lay down in the studio.

The Inside Story

To get a wider perspective on the deals within the wheels of the record companies, I talked to a man with inside experience of the large, medium, and independent labels, who is also a semi-professional musician, writer and broadcaster; DP Kleider. DP's earliest successful business experience was working with a national concern, completely unconnected with music. However, the constant temptation of making a living amid the excitement and creativity of the music business eventually proved to be too much to withstand and soon he was working in A&R on the streets of London.

A conscientious, and perhaps naive, DP would trek the metropolitan suburbs to see potentially interesting bands. Often getting home in the small hours of morning he would be at his desk at 10am to confront the continual flow of demos. This was a distinct contrast to many other A&R people, who to DP, seemed to be expecting it all to fall at their feet. A late gig being the perfect passport to the following day off.

I should explain here, that I'm referring to the bigger record companies. Many A&R men are some of the laziest, most ignorant, inadequate, vacuous people around. It's virtually impossible to hold a coherent conversation with these old or failed musicians, who are so out of touch with music.

But A&R people must get to see and ultimately sign somebody worthwhile sometime.

They usually hear some big new band on The Tube or Whistle Test. This will usually be a band that people like Peel, Kershaw and the vinyl junkies have been aware of for a long time. They then become paranoid that somebody else will sign them, so they go round and round each other in ever decreasing circles to try and sign them up.

There's no way a small label can compete. If they're offered £200,000, they have no reason to sign for £100,000. Of course, what many people don't realise is that these figures are recuperable against royalties. I could sign someone for £2 million, but it would still be against any future royalties.

"...the idea of gimmicks to attract attention tends to make me feel that if it needs that then perhaps the music won't be up to much."

So when one hears of £250,000, it is not necessarily cash handed over?

Some may be cash, for outstanding debts, equipment or tour support. A new band will need to 'buy in' to a tour with a major band, so if you don't get a tour you may not get that money.

What are the chances of getting A&R representatives to go to the gigs of bands outside London?

Whatever they say, A&R people don't travel out of London. I've found it difficult because of the time taken in travelling. I'm very aware of the fact that I've been more out of touch with what is happening in music, whilst in the business; as I'm buying fewer records and hearing less radio. Your critical faculties become dulled by hearing so much of the dross that is received each day. There are northern talent scouts, but it is not easy to get record companies sufficiently interested to travel far and see a band.

You can be enormous in Birmingham, Cardiff or Glasgow, but unless there is a sudden phase of signing everything that moves in an area, you have very little chance of getting a deal.

But the majority of record buyers don't live in London; they live in Birmingham, Cardiff, Glasgow and the provinces. So a band can be massive in terms of press coverage in London and yet mean little or nothing outside it.

Packaging the Deal

Do you think that making a video to gain the interest of A&R is worthwhile?

Certainly, if you aren't able to get to London, or you're in a particularly visual band it may have some interest. I haven't received many, but the idea of gimmicks to attract attention tends to make me feel that if it needs that, then perhaps the music isn't up to much.

Although impracticable, the ideal state for auditioning demos must surely be a committee.

Definitely. Although the number of demos received that have no chance of being accepted is huge. Either they're sent to companies that will not be interested, because the type of band, or music, is not in keeping with that company's output, or else it sounds too similar to something that is already successful.

"Your critical facilities become dulled by hearing so much of the dross that is received each day."

Do you think it's worth putting out a record through independent distribution, possibly with the idea of being picked up later by a major company?

It can be, provided that the major thinks there's a market, because in some instances the independent release will have saturated any further sales possibility. Independently released cassettes have less likelihood of getting played; essentially because they need to be transferred to open reel first, which must act as a barrier. But of course radio play in itself can lead to interest from the companies.

What's your opinion of large scale presentations, that are especially staged for A&R departments?

All too often they are set up by management organisations, and there are relatively famous individuals in the bands. The current tendency is for the bands to be very proficient musicians but unable to write good songs. I would look for the band that did have some intellectual capability.

Take the Money

Supposing a band signs for a long term deal involving several albums, and the first of those consists of all the material that has been developed in the previous years. When they're confronted with the recording of the second album, the band work extremely hard at getting the songs completed, but the company doesn't like them as much as the first ones, and consequently they don't wish to put a lot of money into the album's promotion. The band now have to deliver further material to fulfil their contract, which they know will probably be passed over in favour of more potentially successful bands.

Yes. That's unfortunately true. As soon as you sign up with a big company there is a great deal of money involved. There are accountants watching the budgets, and profits need to be generated so that they can be invested in the next band. Record companies will occasionally regard it as likely that they won't make money until the 3rd album, thinking perhaps if they hang back there'll be a more solid following. That happened with U2. They weren't signed up for very much money, and consequently Island weren't standing to lose much and they could have been dropped. Although now, I believe, the contracts are much better! They had chart singles earlier, but following massive TV exposure on Live Aid all five of their albums went into the charts.

"Many A&R men are some of the laziest, ignorant, inadequate, vacuous people around. It's virtually impossible to hold a coherent conversation with these old or failed musicians who are so out of touch with music."

In what areas will record companies fund 100%?

Marketing, promotion, and at least half of the recording costs. But then part of the promotion, special packaging, double sleeves and so on, will be paid for out of royalties ultimately payable to the band. If you are a band that has no large stage show it can sometimes be better to sign for a smaller deal, such as a proposed advance of £20,000 of which 75% is recoverable by the record company. This way fewer records need to be sold for you to begin receiving royalty payments.

What are the benefits and drawbacks of a 'one off single' deal?

The trouble with large companies is that they have no facility for that small release. There are so many people to be employed that everything has to go through the system. The problem of releasing a Dire Straits single for example in terms of advertising and the like (although that might not be very much, because it will sell anyway) are quite significant. In the time it takes to work on a new single that might sell 5-10,000, they could be producing a cover, say, for something that would sell 250,000 copies.

In reality, the larger record companies deal mainly with anything that's going to sell a minimum of 50,000. They also seem to be incapable of saying, 'Here's £5,000. Go and do it.' It always has to be at least £10,000. The easiest way to succeed is to become attached to a decent management team, if you can put up with the dubious chemical and sexual practices that seem to pervade many of them. It is actually possible to make a great deal of money by any normal person's standards, but by the time you've taken off management percentage, recording fees, tour support, new gear, clothes and so on, there's not a lot left.

As even the most insensitive reader will have realised by now, DP's outlook is, in many respects, rather bleak, and causes one to wonder how companies select the staff of A&R. Indeed, some that I have encountered do appear to have landed the job presumably without the need for any prior experience at all.

However, if you are fortunate you may encounter an A&R man who has developed his career with a degree of awareness evolved from naivety, and who will come as a breath of fresh air.

But despite all this, DP still has a fascination with the business and still keeps a keen eye or two open for new artists. His horizons have been broadened, and now for his sins he's about to visit the States and will be staying a while with the Bangles!

By the way, DP, I'm not really doing very much this summer, and I just wanted to ask...