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The Cultural Revolution

The Cult

Article from International Musician & Recording World, September 1986

Are The Cult hippies? Do they like guitar solos? Do they know what other people think of them, and do they care? Chris Maillard has the answers....


Call them hippies if you like, but The Cult are on a bit of a crusade back to the days of real groups. Or so they say...

Image credit: George Bodnar

You can call The Cult hippies if you like. A lot of people do. But you can't deny that they've been more hugely successful than many would-be Pop whizzkids with designer hairstyles and balance sheets where their hearts should be: after all, in a business divided and defined by cults and sub-cults, what better name could a band take than The Cult? While others were dabbling with blends of hip-hop and heavy existentialism, The Cult found their raw material amongst the bits that had been thrown away. Bits like Heavy Rock's powerful rhythm section, and vast U2-ish chorussed guitar that everyone else thought had been sucked dry ages ago. Then there's the vague mysticism and half-digested Woodstock philosophy, and to cap it all, a smidgeon of Punk chic.

You can call them hippies if you like, but The Cult really don't care. You can point at them and shout 'Led Zeppelin!' if you like, but it won't bother them a bit. The fact is, The Cult don't take any of this as seriously as you might expect...

"A good Cult song..." mused singer Ian Astbury, "is one with loads and loads of lead guitar. No, honestly, lots of solos, wah-wah pedal, stuff like that, where I can have a good yell and shake me hair about all over the place..."

He laughed manically. You could call Ian Astbury a hippie, but I'd like to leave the room first, please, because he's a tall, impressively hairy character with a distinctly odd glint in his eye.

"We don't deal in the cliches," he affirmed. "Well, that's to say we sometimes do the very obvious thing, particularly live, but if we do then it's very tongue-in-cheek."

So how would he describe the band?

"Err... I don't know. I can't think of a witticism to fit that question today. I'm not feeling particularly witty. But we're not hippies."

Fair enough. This is not to say, however, that the band are completely normal.

"In the studio, I have to get psyched up to do a vocal take," confesses the hairy one. "Because obviously you can't do a vocal track completely cold. So I have great long conversations with Pete Brown, our producer. I remember before one track we had a four-hour conversation about sharks. We ended up doing the take at four in the morning...

"Of course, there are other ways of relieving the tension in the studio. In one recently we got caught photocopying our bottoms. Just sitting on the machine doing copies, we were, and someone came in.

"The woman who ran the studio had the machine disinfected the next morning...

"We don't take the whole thing completely seriously. We're not under that sort of pressure. It'd be just a job otherwise, and nobody wants that. No, it's a lot of fun, this band."

But while the front man breezes in at nine in the evening to put on his warblings, somebody has to do the donkey work. The day shift comprises Billy Duffy, the guitarist and main songwriter, Jamie Stewart, the astonishingly solid bassist, and Les Warner, the new boy behind the big drumkit.

"We're on a bit of a crusade," stated Billy, "back to the days of real groups. With the new album, which we're just doing demos for, we're deliberately trying to make the drums sound more like drums, the bass like a bass guitar, and the guitar like proper guitar playing, like a bloke standing there with a guitar and an amp instead of all this bloody sampling and synthesisers and nonsense.

"It's not that we're against using technology as such — I mean I use pedals, delay and chorus and so on, but these days it seems to be all technique and technology. There's no feeling involved, it's all programmed out.

"I'm glad there's less of that snobbery about now than there was in the days of Punk; you know, all that stuff where people would praise the hip names like 'Iggy' and slag off the old ones like 'Lizzy'.

"Let's face it, almost everyone in a pro group these days must have grown up in the mid-Seventies when they would have learnt their guitar, or bass, or whatever, playing along to their Free or Thin Lizzy records. I mean I can't remember the riff to Emerald by Thin Lizzy now, but I used to do all that sort of stuff. And I'm not ashamed to say so, unlike so many others. But that's going now, I'm pleased to say. I think everyone must be sick to death of all the artificial stuff about. They want something real."

So how do you go about sounding real without sounding like a rehearsal at the village hall? Billy?

"Well, I always use amps miked up, never DI the guitar. Usually in the studio I'll use four combos, all miked in stereo, and mix down the result to get the sound I want.

"I use a Roland JC120 as the backbone of the sound, with a valve amp as well — these days I'm using Ampegs, because they're somewhere between a Marshall and a Fender and really loud — and some others. Peaveys are pretty good, and I've got this horrible Yamaha 2x12 combo, a really crappy copy of a Fender Twin, but transistor, and it's really old. I keep trying to give it away but every time we record it appears from the corner of the lock-up and we use it and, somehow, it always sounds good. That amp is on every one of our records somewhere.

"The JC120 I use because it's really clean and the chorus is brilliant. I use that rather than a pedal chorus, on all the time, to fill the sound out. The only problem is they're prone to blowing up. Roland have been very good about it, every time one's gone — usually the speakers — they've replace it or changed the speakers, but I don't know why they couldn't have put decent speakers in to start with.

"To make it sound even bigger I use delays, like the Boss ones, the sampler/digital delay and the analogue one. I don't use the sampler bit, but they're good delays. And I've got a Boss Super Overdrive as well, which is the best overdrive I've heard. I don't think anyone makes a nicer-sounding one.

"I'll use anything you can step on, but I'm not a big fan of that rack stuff. It looks like home hi fi gear to me. And I'm not as precise as a lot of bands are about using effects. When we had Mark Brzezicki from Big Country drumming for us a while ago, he said one day 'here's the tempo, if you want to set your delays' and started drumming. I suddenly realised that Big Country all set their echo units to the speed of the track. I'm not into all that fiddling about, I just have them on the same setting most of the time. It all adds that rawness which makes us sound like we do."

"I think some of that has obviously come about through playing live," added bassist Jamie cheerfully. "With our format — just the four of us — we can listen to each other and use that understanding to make the tracks more interesting. Les is very much a guitarist's drummer, he listens to the guitar parts and plays off them. I used to play guitar myself, so I work a bit more closely with Billy than maybe most bassists would. We're quite a tight little unit, so we don't really need to beef things up too much in the studio."

"And we all actually enjoy playing with this band," said Billy. "It's not a brain strain or a bore, it's what we all want to do played the way we want to play it. I don't care if people call us a Rock band or a Punk band or what, we are quite happy to be doing our own style of music."

What if people called you hippies?

"Errrrr..." he said, tactfully.

Billy duffy's Gear: The Big White Gretsch

Image credit: George Bodnar

"Since I got my Gretsch I've never used anything else on a recording. The thing about mine, though, is that it's not an old one, it's mid-Seventies. I don't like the old ones, they're not functional at all. When I'm on tour people keep trying to sell me 1958 Gretsches and I don't want them, frankly, they don't work.

"The one I've got, the White Falcon, I've had it three years and I've dropped it and stuff, but nothing's ever gone wrong with it. It stays in tune perfectly well, it's got the original machine heads on it, and it's absolutely standard as it came out of the factory.

"You see, my idea is to get a guitar that you like and work within its limitations. I don't like this idea where somebody gets a guitar and rips it to pieces, changes the pickups, all that stuff.

"The sound is the foremost thing about Gretsches; it's a certain spread of sound due to the pickups and the way they're constructed. Once I realised what the guitar was doing, I extended that idea and started using chorus to spread it further, using two amps and even using the PA as an extension of the backline by splitting it in stereo. I've got a sort of wall of sound now just from that. We tried to work out exactly what it was doing and it turns out it's giving off some weird resonant harmonics...

"I started using one in Theatre Of Hate, my last band, but that wasn't very guitar-orientated material. I just liked the guitar, and when I started with this band I decided to see how heavy it was possible to get using one. The only person I'd heard using one for very heavy stuff was Malcolm Young, the rhythm guitarist from AC/DC, and I liked his sound a lot, so I thought 'why not?'.

"I've been in a position to try all the so-called 'great guitars' and they don't really do anything for me. I'm not a collector, I've only got one other White Falcon, as a spare, and a Gretsch Country Club which I picked up for £400 and sprayed black because it was natural wood finish which is a bit ineffectual. That's alright.

"I really like the tremolo unit on Gretsches — they've got Bigsby units with kind of bent levers and they're very subtle. If you use that with a bit of chorus and some distortion weird things start coming out... which I like. I'm a great believer in glorious accidents.

"The first time I ever saw a White Falcon was years ago when a mate of mine was really into Neil Young. I was a punk at the time and I said 'naaaah' — I wanted a White Les Paul like Steve Jones. Then I saw Matthew Ashman using one with Bow Wow Wow. I used to go and see them to see his guitar! I never liked the band. For a While I used double-cutaway Falcons, but they're stereo and I didn't realise for ages that they're a lot less powerful than the mono ones, the wiring's weird on them.

"Gretsches are virtually impossible to play above the twelfth fret, so you can't do a lot of those standard Heavy Rock things like solo right up the neck.

"I do play very loud — in America they clocked me at two dB below the threshold of pain — but I damp the strings with my palm to cut out the feedback. The guitar's stuffed with cotton wool, but I don't know if that does any good or not. There's no doubt, they do feed back like a bastard but because they're new, not really old ones, it's more controllable.

"They're really reliable guitars, and they look great but they're so expensive now. I paid double for my second one, a few months ago, than I did for my first, three years before."


Jamie Stewart's gear: The Bass End

Image credit: George Bodnar

"I play a Tokai Hard Puncher — I got it free in Japan and it ended up as my main bass. It's a cross between a Jazz and a Precision; it's got one of each type of pickup.

"Previous to that I had a '63 Jazz, which was pretty good too, but was getting well and truly smashed up because of all the gigging.

"I tried a Status bass on the last album, which is a very nice instrument with an excellent tone; a very well-built precision instrument. But it's not me, really. I need a bit of raunch and a bit of rasp from the frets, a bit of worn-in-ness. Which is why I went for the Jazz bass and why I went for the Tokai — for a new instrument it's got a lot of character and a very well-worn feel to it.

"Soundwise I'd like to try and get somewhere between Jean-Jacques Burnel and John Entwistle, with quite a lot of middle and top. Particularly live, where you find a lot of stages throw off loads of bottom end, so you need to punch out quite a lot of top so you can hear a note rather than just a dull boom.

"I use Trace Elliott amps, which are just... fine. They do the job well and reliably, and the graphic's useful. I hadn't heard of them until people kept recommending them and I thought 'who is this Tracey Elliot?' Then one of the road crew got me one and I went 'Ohh!' I also use a few pedals — a chorus, mostly, just to fill the sounds out, and also an overdrive in case I want to leap out of the mix and make myself heard a bit more. I have used an Octave Divider, as well, but you can't get a clean bottom end from that as often as I'd like."


Les Warner's gear: New Kit In Town

Image credit: George Bodnar

"My drumkit's called Hermann. It's a Sonor, which I'm pretty happy with, and I've got a deal with them now.

"I use a deep snare, 14"x8", because I like that big sound — my style is that I hit the snare pretty regularly, so it's important that it sounds solid enough.

"I've got 10", 12", 13", 14", and 15" tom toms, and I've got a lot of cymbals as well, so it's a pretty big kit. I use big sticks as well, 'C's, to get the sound I want, which is sort of heavy and solid. I really like John Bonham, and Brian Downey from Thin Lizzy, and Richie Hayward from Little Feat. They've got excellent technique, but they can play heavy when it's needed, like Ian Paice from Deep Purple.

"My role within the band is obviously to supply the rhythm you know, I'm obviously not playing melodies and stuff, so I have to get a sound that is deep and punchy. But at the same time, I do listen to Billy's guitar and try to sit in with what he's doing quite a lot.

"I play a big kit not because I use all of it at once, but because it gives you so many more possibilities in sound, there are more things you can do without trying to be too busy on a small Kit. I wouldn't use double bass drums, for instance, because I like to keep the hi hat steady a lot of the time and I'd lose that trying to work two basses.

"All in all, I'd like to be recognised as the sort of drummer that drives a band along really well rather than the sort that just does fills all over the place."


Ian Astbury's Gear: The Tambourines, Man

Image credit: George Bodnar


"I like the round tambourines, the classic style — I think the moonshaped ones sound alright in the studio, but live they're not as good. I prefer the type with two sets of bells on them, rather than just one, and I never use ones with skins on.

"You see, with round tambourines you can do lots of things with them, like flick them round your wrist, spin them, headbutt them or whatnot. Actually, I started using basic wooden tambourines, the Premier ones, and I don't think they're very good. The guy that buys our gear bought me this one, just a basic wooden one, that was made in Pakistan and it's brilliant. My favourite tambourine. I don't know what sort of wood it is, but it only cost him three quid.

"I think all the professional percussion manufacturers, when it comes to things like tambourines they can't really be bothered, they just knock them together. The best ones I've found come from the Far East — you can get them at Ray Man's shop in Covent Garden.

"I've developed quite a few tricks of my own with the tambourine, and I've started using two now sometimes. But I do cut my hands up a lot. They're covered with scars and callouses now, they get a real hammering. It must be one of the most physically demanding instruments you can play, the tambourine."



Previous Article in this issue

Workbench

Next article in this issue

Feelers On The Dealers


Publisher: International Musician & Recording World - Cover Publications Ltd, Northern & Shell Ltd.

The current copyright owner/s of this content may differ from the originally published copyright notice.
More details on copyright ownership...

 

International Musician - Sep 1986

Artist:

The Cult


Role:

Band/Group

Interview by Chris Maillard

Previous article in this issue:

> Workbench

Next article in this issue:

> Feelers On The Dealers


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